Pauw & Witteman

Laura Dekker on the 'Pauw & Witteman' talkshow

Vara TV, The Netherlands

English Transcript by Thomas Weber

Monday, March 5th 2012, 11:05 PM

Hosts:

Jeroen Pauw [JP]

Paul Witteman [PW]

Laura at Pauw & Witteman
Screen capture: Gerard / Collage: Rikki

Paul Witteman: "Laura Dekker, the 'Zeilmeisje' [Sailor girl]. She sailed around the world in one year and one day - the following pictures were broadcasted in about 63 countries. [Arrival in Sint Maarten on January 21st]

***

PW.: "Welcome Laura!"

Laura Dekker: "Thanks."

PW.: "We are proud of you so you can be at ease, we won't pick on you."

L.: "OK."

PW.: "I am asking myselfsince you are known all over the world, when you arrive somewhere, are the people waiting to cheer for you at the dock? Do they know who you are?"

L.: "Fortunately no, but after a day they know. They recognize my boat more than me which is very nice though. Well, some people do recognize me but they don't wait for me at the dock. This only happened in St. Maarten."

PW.: "That was the finish?"

L.: "That's where I finished..."

PW.: "But what does the people say... You have been in Cape Town, am I right?

L.: "Yes..."

PW.: "... There are people who read about you in the newspaper and must tell themselves 'Let's give her a warm welcome'?" 

L.: "Mostly I wasn’t saying where I was sailing to and as I arrived it was a big surprise to the people who were there - oh, that's Laura! But sometimes it happened that people have come to me and said 'I have followed your trip...'"

PW.: "Via your blog?"

L.: "... via the blog or other media. They came to wish me success or just came by."

PW.: "We are proud of you because what you did is a great achievement. We will talk more about the difficulties you had a bit later.

***

Jeroen Pauw: "We are now talking to Laura Dekker, most of us know her as Laura the 'Zeilmeisje' [Sailor Girl]. On January 20 [2011] you departed. You have been on your trip for one year and one day. But frst, let's have a look at some pictures you took during your trip."

[Video]

JP.: "The final image is your arrival in St. Maarten. Who are the people hugging you?"

L.: "My sister, my father and my mother."

JP.: "Did you meet them at each of your waypoints?"

L.: "No. Back then I had not seen my mother and my sister for about one year. The last time I saw my father was in South Africa a few months earlier."

JP.: "We have just seen pictures that were taken during your sailing. Were those cameras mounted on the boat?"

L.: "No, I took those with a small camera."

JP.: "And the picture of you sitting on the foredeck. Is that a place where you sat often while sailing?"

L.: "When the wind was not too strong, yes."

JP.: "Does this happen very often on a voyage like this that there is not much wind?"

L.: "Yes... it depends on where you are on the globe, but the wind is good most of the time.

JP.: "Is it boring sometimes or not at all?"

L.: "That's what I thought too... I spent much time thinking about what to do aboard the boat, but..."

JP.: "For example?"

L.: "I thought of writing, filming, reading and the like, but you are kept busy sailing and navigating so sometime it becomes timeless. A day with all its necessary things to do and the sailing passes by, and... yes."

JP.: "You went to bed as darkness fell and got up with the morning light?"

L.: "I tried to sleep whenever possible. That's very important since you always have to be ready to stay awake for very long. When you start feeling tired it's almost too late  If something happens and you have to stay awake. When it was possible to sleep during the day I would keep the radar switched on and take a nap."

JP.: "How long can you sleep in one stretch at best?"

L.: "One hour at most. If I am sailing on the open sea I switch on the radar alarm..."

JP.: "Radar alarm - if something appears on the screen then a bell starts ringing and then you wake-up?"

L.: "... right, once a ship appears then it starts beeping."

JP.: "You sleep for one hour maximum?"

L.: "Yes. Then you get up, take a look around and go back to bed for another hour. I didn't stay awake for too long."

JP.: "How many hours of sleep did you have in a day?"

L.: "The usual amount. You sleep at day and at night and stay awake at many different times."

JP.: "Do you still have problems with that? Sleeping for one hour and awaking?"

L.: "Well... you get used to it at some point. It's not that difficult." 

JP.: "They give classes for this, right?"

L.: "As far as I know there are no classes for this. This would be 'weird' actually."

JP.: "Yes, it is impossible to practice this ashore. A boat is moving constantly, everything is changing all the time. You simply cannot sleep, so you awake and take a look around. There are not too many things in a bedroom that needs to be checked."      

JP.: "We have read that you took some training in sleep management."

L.: "Err... No, no. That was something very strange with the Court... some people thought of this who know nothing about sailing."

JP.: "Really?"

L.: "Those people thought: 'Well, the boat is sailing and she has to sleep sometime', and they thought it is impossible. This is a bit absurd of course. You actually don't have to do anything about it, you just fall into the rhythm naturally, well..."

PW.: "What was the most dangerous situation of your trip?"

L.: "I don't know, there were not many dangerous situations, but..."

PW.: "... just tell us about the few you experienced..."

L.: "The Torres Strait; back then I had to keep very attentive. Cape Town was very tough, the whole of South Africa actually, and the Indian Ocean crossing took very long."

PW.: "Heavy seas?"

L.: "In Cape Town I had very much wind, force 10 to 11 [on the Beaufort scale], that is very much.

JP.: "Give us an example, what is ‘11’? How high are the waves then?"

L.: "I sailed close to the shore then, so the waves were lower than for this kind of wind [lower than the waves would be on the open sea at this wind force]. But even with all the sails down the boat was knocked down. The portholes were under water."

PW.: "We have seen a picture that showed some problems with one sail. Let's take a look and maybe you could explain what happened there."

[Video of the torn Genoa, Torres Strait, Australia in August 2011]

PW.: "For the people we added a small arrow to the picture. That was a tear in the sail..."

L.: "Yes, it was completely..."

PW.: "I would have taken my mobile phone and asked for an helicopter to pick me up. How did you solve that problem?"

L.: "I took down the sail. I have two furling fore sails, I hoisted the small jib and with daylight the next day I hoisted a new Genoa."

JP.: "Are you able to repair something like that?"

L.: "This [the Genoa] could not be repaired anymore; it was torn on the whole length."

JP.: "What do you have to be able to repair on such a trip?"

L.: "You have to be very inventive. Mostly you don't have exactly those spare parts you need with you on the boat, but there is always a piece of rope you can use to tie things up."

JP.: "Could you give examples of the things that broke and the way you solved the problem?"

L.: "Well, for example I had to repair the wind vane that is mounted with a stainless ring to the [inaudible], and this one had broken off..."

JP.: "[to PW.] Wind vane, stainless steel ring? Can you follow her?"

PW.: "Of course!"

L.: That [the wind vane] is that thing that is on the boat's stern...also a [rudder blade?] had broken off, and I reattached it with a rope, and there were many other things, too. Rope and Duct Tape..."

PW.: "Just a few words about the preparations, otherwise we skip those. How did you choose a boat?"

L.: "It depends on taste. Everyone favours a different boat. A sturdy boat is a good choice. The dimensions were important, and I could handle it very well. She ['Guppy'] is a sturdy boat that can take a lot. It is two masted and relatively level, and so I could handle her easily. Besides that, I really appreciated this design, yes..."

PW.: "What do you have to take along on the trip?"

L.: "What do you take along, well... That again depends on you. When you prepare your boat then you install those devices you think you will need, the wind vane for example, that is situated at the stern that steers the boat. As a solo sailor you need something like that to be able to sleep. You have to think about what you will need before going."

PW.: "Did you take books with you, a cookbook for example..."

L.: "Noooo - no. But you have to be creative. And taking food with you is not a bad idea, too."

JP.: "You can cook a little bit?"

L.: "I even improved my skills. But then it was good that I only had to cook for myself."

PW.: "There were no victims?"

L.: "Only me."

PW.: "In your guestbook on your website many people asked questions to you, whether you could take a shower onboard for example?"     

L.: "No. Most boats are equipped with a shower, but not mine. Also I didn't have enough fresh water on board to take a shower every day. I had to shower with salt water."

PW.: [basically] That's bad for your skin.

L.: "Then you most not sit in the sun."

PW.: "You can avoid that?"

L.: "Yes, I avoided that."

JP.: "Did you have to take schoolbooks with you?"

L.: "I did not have to but I did schoolwork on my trip."

JP.: "You really did schoolwork?"

L.: "Yes!!"

JP.: "Learning French vocabulary for example?"

L.: "I don't have French as a school subject but yes, I learned vocabulary. Basically it was the same as in an usual school, it were the same subjects I learned. The only difference was that I have had a book with me that contained the explanations that would usually be given by the teacher."

JP.: "Did you manage to do this?"

L.: "Yes. Of course there were moments, during a storm for example, I could not sit down with three books and do schoolwork as things flew around me. But when I was ashore I had the discipline to do schoolwork each morning."

PW.: "There are many people who can sail very good, Jeroen [Pauw] is a very good sailor, but those people would not be able to circumnavigate the world..."

JP.: "No way!"

PW.: "... my question is: What else do you need beside very good sailing skills to manage it?"

L.: " I have no idea... we could have a very long discussion about that. I think it depends on what you want to do. If you want to circumnavigate the world then you have to be able to be alone by yourself. Better for the people who cannot be alone not to try this.

PW.: "How did you know that you would be able to be alone?"

L.: I did not know it before I tried, but I wanted to know if I could. I knew that I don't need people around me all the time. I always found it great to go sailing alone. Of course, it was not the first time I had sailed somewhere."

JP.: "We would like to show an animation of your trip."

[Video]

JP.: "Given you are alone [at sea] for 47 days [crossing from Darwin to Durban]... do you count the days?"

L.: "No. Sometimes you loose your sense of time, it's not important what month, what day and certainly not what time it is."

JP.: "Did you loose your sense of time?"

LD.: "Actually no. The Indian Ocean was pretty tough. During the first two weeks I had no wind at all. Bobbing up and down was very much annoying. Then we had a storm. I really had to fight through, but once I arrived [in Durban], I felt a great satisfaction."

JP.: "Do you sometimes... how should I say... sing, talk to yourself or do something else to..."

LD.: "No. It's very odd to talk to yourself. When I hear my own voice then I think: 'Yeeees, that's so "weird"'. And then I stop immediately."

PW.: "But there are people who..."

LD.: "There are people who do so, but I don't like listening to myself."

PW.: "Some of the people who evaluated you [in 2009] said, 'she is intelligent, of course, she is strong and she keeps cool'. Do you agree with this?"

LD.: "I don't know." (laughs)

PW.: "What did one psychologist say [in 2009]? ... She said that empathy is not too well integrated in your character, in other words, that you don't recognize feelings as a burden."

LD.: "No."

PW.: "You don't allow yourself to be homesick?"

LD.: "No."

PW.: "And you are never homesick?"

LD.: "No, I enjoy everything around me. To return to one of your questions: you really have to love the sea to do this [circumnavigation]. If you think: 'I like sailing and, jip, I like swimming and water, too...

PW.: "... so let's sail around the globe..."

LD.: "... otherwise it won't work. It's difficult to put in words but you have to have something for it." 

JP.: "When you did a long distance crossing, did you feel happy when you saw another boat in the distance?"

LD.: "Of course! As you sail over the huge ocean and see a fellow sailor, that is something very special, it does not happen very often. Then you can get in touch with the radio, and that is very nice."

JP.: "And you can give tips to each other..."

PW.: "... for cooking..."

LD.: "Yes, we have had extensive talks about baking bread, fish or things like that."

JP.: "You have been in islands, harbours and visited many places, and I am sure you met people who were on a round the world trip, people of my age or even older, alcoholics maybe, who have sold their house and their belongings, bought a ship and became stranded somewhere. Did you meet those people, too?"

LD.: "Yes, I have met many different people. People with boats I thought 'Why didn't it sink a long time ago?!' and people with mega-yachts who have no idea about sailing who have to hire someone to do the sailing for them. And also you meet many nice people you want to keep in touch with."

JP.: "You do?"

LD.: "Yes, I made many friends."

PW.: "Talking about nice people... there were many people who voiced critics about your trip, not so much about you. We would like to talk about this, but before we will have a look at some pictures from this critical period."

[Video covering the events of August to December 2009]

PW.: "What do you think about this period today?"

LD.: "Well, it was a hard. It rolled all over me. I wanted to do something that my parents had agreed I could do, I was well prepared and then suddenly a flood of media and unpleasant things were directed at me. On the one hand, I don't favour the media, all I wanted was to sail. On the other hand I was portayed as someone who tries to draw attention, but then if you refuse to talk to the media, it will simply go and invent something about you..."

PW.: "And finally, you... escaped, as one could say."

LD.: "Right, I was fed up with it." (laughs)

PW.: "And how... Did you do this spontaneously or did you prepare for a long time?"

LD.: "No, I was not too long, but I was just fed up and so I went away."

PW.: "Did you tell your father?"

LD.: "No... no. It was more like 'Yeah, I do it!' But it was very nice..."

PW.: "To run away?"

LD.: "Yes."

PW.: "But now you are back."

LD.: "Yes... It's very cold here."

JP.: "You struck down the Dutch flag because you were so angry [with the Netherlands] and instead you hoisted the New Zealand flag..."

                 

LD.: "Because they had started again and kept on... Sometimes I just have had enough."

JP.: "The officials from - what is it called..."

PW.: "School attendance..."

LD.: "Yeah..."

JP.: "School attendance officials, right?"

LD.: "Amongst others, yes."

JP.: "Is the case now closed?"

LD.: "Not yet. It is still going on, but... well."

JP.: "Are you still worried about that or do you just think 'Come off it!'?"

LD.: "I experienced so much since..."

  

JP.: "Do you have to get your school graduation? And do you want to get it?"

LD.: "I'd like to do so, yes. I always kept learning for school and it is my intention to go back to school and to graduate."

JP.: "Will there be another challenge after that?"

LD.: "Sure. The world is big."

JP.: "What's your next challenge?"

LD.: "I don't know but I would like to go back to New Zealand. It is my native country and yes, I'd really like to go there. Moreover, it's a sailing country like Australia, and I'd like to do something with sailing."

JP.: "You were born there?"

LD.: "Yes, I was born there."

JP.: "Aboard a boat?"

LD.: "Yes."

GW.: "What do you mean by 'something with sailing'?"

LD.: "'Something with sailing' - yeah, that's not clear yet. I don't know exactly what it will be, but New Zealand and Australia are real sailing countries..."

GW.: "Big sailing competitions maybe? You could earn a lot of money with big sponsors. Do you want to do something like that?"

LD.: "Maybe. Even though I took part in many sailing competitions I really like tour sailing. [Maybe I will become] Crewmember on a boat or Captain or something like that. There are far more opportunities over there than in Europe."

JP.: "You have been at the Volvo Ocean Race in..."

LD.: "... in Cape Town."

JP.: "They sail much faster than you?"

LD.: "That's a lot harder, indeed."

JP.: "Could you do that, too?"

LD.: "Err... ... I am not sure. That's totally different. There is a whole team on the boat and ashore, unlike me since I am always alone and have to manage everything on my own. Those boats sail at 20 knots speed while I am very happy when I get 6 knots. It's completely different."

JP.: "Can you earn money with sailing?"

LD.: "If you do it well, yes. But sailing around the world... no."

JP.: "You are busy writing a book?"

LD.: "Yes."

JP.: " 'Een meisje - een droom' [A girl - a dream] or is it 'Een meisje en droom' [A girl and dream]?"

LD.: " It's 'Een meisje - een droom'.

JP.: "One dream - multiple dreams?"

LD.: "One dream."

JP.: "The book will be released soon. Tonight we only have the cover here with us (he browses in the blank book pages). When will it be released?"

LD.: "I have no idea. It depends on how good I work on it. That's all I wrote so far.

JP.: "This here?" (he points on the blurb)

LD.: "No, I am working hard on it."

GW.: "What has happened with the boat?"

LD.: "I keep living on her. And I'll keep her,  there is a relationship between us."

GW.: "Where is 'Guppy' now? In St. Maarten?"

LD.: "In Bonaire."

JP.: "There is still a lot of work to do before you get to New Zealand."

LD.: "Yes. (laughs) That's again half the world approximately."

GW.: "But you will sail to New Zealand?"

LD.: "Yes. I would really like to sail the Pacific Ocean again."

GW.: "I think so, too. You did not see too much of it."

LD.: "No, but I crossed it so very fast..."

GW.: "It was over before you realized it."

LD.: "Yes, it went too fast. So I have to do it again."

- END -